Guess the format

Discussion in 'Open Gear Talk' started by wt21, Dec 8, 2013.

  1. wt21

    wt21 Hall of Famer Subscribing Member

    Aug 15, 2010
    Interesting little game

    Found this on fujirumors, saying you can't tell the difference in bokeh (I think they meant DOF). So many of the comparisons are in NON-bokeh situations, but I find you can tell the difference if you look at DR (in dynamic DR situations), color richness (in dynamic color situations) and sometimes bokeh. I found I was more successful in comparing 43 vs. APS-C & FF, or compact to anything else. Less successful at APS-C vs. FF.

    Also, for clearly deeply stopped down photos in landscapes and even lighting, I just skip, since just about any camera could take those and adequately represent an image in this web-sized format. Also, some images are clearly HDRed or have other treatments, which makes it harder to judge.

    How did y'all do?
    • Like Like x 4
  2. staticantics

    staticantics Regular

    Oct 15, 2013
    Central California
    Thats a fun experiment. I got 16 out of 20 correct, but I think this page is even more interesting after taking these test, the stats. :
  3. Luckypenguin

    Luckypenguin Hall of Famer

    Dec 24, 2010
    Brisbane, Australia
    I guessed one of the 4/3 versus full frame questions correctly because I knew that the 4/3 image wouldn't have dust spots on it :biggrin:
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  4. wt21

    wt21 Hall of Famer Subscribing Member

    Aug 15, 2010
    I have found that when I know it, I know it. It's the edge cases I am usually wrong on.

    There is a full frame "pop" that, when it's there, it's there in spades. It's usually about the color, contrast and DOF mixed, and often it says "FF or Compact" or "FF or 43" I have rarely missed those. But I almost always miss those stopped down landscape shots that say "APS-C or FF." I can't get above 60% right, lol.
  5. Luckypenguin

    Luckypenguin Hall of Famer

    Dec 24, 2010
    Brisbane, Australia
    I was rubbish; only 58% before I got bored. The only ones I could consistently guess was compact vs anything else, or the ridiculously shallow depth-of-field shots as FF. I also mistook a few old 4/3 DSLR shots (e.g. E-410) as compact. There was one APS-C vs 4/3 I got right simply because the photographer was one of my contacts I know he has a Nikon D90, in addition to my aforementioned guess of FF over 4/3 simply because the image had dust spots.
  6. TraamisVOS

    TraamisVOS Hall of Famer

    Nov 29, 2010
    Melboune, Australia
    I did this a day or two ago, got about a 43% rating before I stopped playing. I think some of the photographs were intentionally selected to present slightly lesser quality (eg. noisier) or shallow/deep depth of field to trick the player into guessing a smaller sensor was used and vice versa. I saw a couple of photos that were taken with a 5DmkIII or mkII which weren't that great to begin with. I guess the lesson is that it's still the photographer's skill that determines the quality of the photograph.
  7. Lawrence A.

    Lawrence A. Hall of Famer

    Nov 8, 2012
    New Mexico
    I was doing about 73% before I stopped. A lot of it was luck. At the sizes on-screen I would not expect to notice any significant difference in quality, and some of my quesses were based more on the geometry of the frame than anything else. Interesting. I don't know how significant, but interesting.

    More importantly, do I get the shot I expect when I trip the shutter on whatever camera I'm using? Now that's a question of some importance.
  8. Like you, Lawrence, I stopped partway. There is no real way of telling the photographs apart, in the sense of which format was which. I rather think that was the point of the exercise. I stopped at 32 and had only got 21 right. But, they were all guesses, and a 50:50 chance of getting it right tells me I had NO idea what I was doing.
  9. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Jul 3, 2010
    To me, this game is a bit like "Smell the color". I already know it isn't possible to tell the difference between formats based on images this size, so if the test shows otherwise, it is a poorly done test.

    A Micro 4/3 shot at f/X, Ymm, and ISO Z is going to look like a full frame shot at f2X, 2Ymm, and ISO 4Z if the lens performance and sensor technology are similar. I've demonstrated this for myself and others countless times.

    A full frame shot with a Tamron 28-300 zoom set to 30mm, f/16, ISO 20,800 is going to look just like an iPhone shot at 4.1mm, f/2.2, ISO 400, assuming that we're talking about a full frame camera with a recently developed CMOS sensor.
    • Like Like x 2
  10. Ray Sachs

    Ray Sachs Legend

    Sep 21, 2010
    Not too far from Philly
    you should be able to figure it out...
    I won't even try - I know I'd suck at it. I can already get such narrow DOF with various m43 lenses and got such narrow DOF with some of the Fuji stuff I had, I'm pretty sure I couldn't tell one sliver of a shot in focus from another. Even with the new Olympus 12-40 zoom at f2.8, using it's close focus capabilities, I get this:

    View attachment 81922
    DOF by ramboorider1, on Flickr

    With the 75 f1.8 or 25 f1.4, not to mention the Voigtlander's at f0.95, m43 can get narrow to the point of uselessness. I know you can go narrower with full frame and with some lenses, it would be sort of nice. But I can do as much with my RX1 as I ever hope to, so I'm not too much more concerned with the range of possibilities with different lenses.

    So, I'd flunk. I know I'd flunk. So I decided not to put myself through it...

  11. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Jul 3, 2010
    Yep, with the Voigtlander 17/0.95 at close distances, I often make the mistake of not stopping down enough:

    PC070046 by Amin Sabet, on Flickr

    And if anyone says they can tell this 75/1.8 shot from one taken with a Canon 70-200/4, I don't believe 'em:

    Sam by Amin Sabet, on Flickr
  12. wt21

    wt21 Hall of Famer Subscribing Member

    Aug 15, 2010
    well, there aren't many DOF/Bokeh in the tests. It's a lot landscape stopped way down.

    One thing I noticed -- it seems any time there is an isolated bird shot with super-blurred background, it's usually an old e-system (Oly) cam with a super long lens. Those old Olys must have been a birder's best friend.
  13. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Jul 3, 2010
    All the more reason for it to be impossible to tell the format.
  14. RidgeRunner22

    RidgeRunner22 Regular

    May 31, 2013
    Jackson, WY
    I got 74%. I felt confident in the FF landscapes, and in most of the compact pictures. Aps-c vs m4/3 is hard, but the colors on the m4/3 often seem to rich to me for some reason.The picture of the fruit stand is a great example. Anyway lots of guess work, but I thought it was a cool exercise. It was a bit humbling to see some of the pictures from the compacts.
  15. wt21

    wt21 Hall of Famer Subscribing Member

    Aug 15, 2010
    I also found it fun to take a guess, then when I was wrong, look at the picture to figure out where it was retouched. I wish that was in the EXIF, lol.